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Off Topic Somewhere between relevance and SPAM lies Off Topic. Topics involving participation or discussion can be posted here. Photochops encouraged.

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Old 06-28-2006   #1 (permalink)
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Digital photography

This post will be long and will be of interest to those that have or expect to purchase a digital camera in the near future.

As professional photographers we have delayed changing from film to digital capture because initially there were some problems with digital which we stayed away from. The time has come that major camera manufacturers are now limiting the number of models of film cameras they produce, quitting production altogether and in the larger formats (called medium format) even selling out. So we felt like the writing was on the proverbial wall and it was time to start a transition to digital cameras and we purchased our first.

Now, for the real purpose of this post. I have always considered our profession as visually capturing and saving a small piece of time, 1/60 th of a second (if that was my shutter setting) of time that you could never go back to but see thru my image. Not only professionals but think of all of the family scrap books, shoe boxes, etc. full of old family “history”.

As a result of the new camera purchase, my son, Rob and I, were discussing the future problem of image storage. For 26 years, we have had a filing system for our film negatives and with them being stored in a dark, heated & cooled, low humidity area they are practically “permanent”. When we become all digital we will have no negatives, only electronic images. The uninformed would say CD disc are cheap, use them. We have read that CD disc are no where near being considered a permanent
storage medium. In fact the cheaper disc may start to deteriorate in as little as three years. The Higher priced gold plated CD’s will last longer.

My guess is that most home photographers using digital shoot a lot of images because of the “no” cost of processing. You go home, look at the images on the computer, print a few of the best, put the others on a CD and “archive” them. Some of the ink jet printing medium being used at home is not archival and the CD’s aren’t either. I am not trying to promote business but the paper we print on “Fuji Crystal Archival” has been tested to have a life of 100 years under good storage conditions. The real purpose of my post is to try to enlighten some that years from now the piece of history we now call the family photo album may not exist. That would be a disaster!

It is a problem our studio will soon be facing and we will solve it but I can’t be sure that the same solution with our high volume will be practical at home. Will tell more as I know more!

Any questions, e-mail, PM me or post.

Don

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Old 06-28-2006   #2 (permalink)
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Re: Digital photography

I do agree with you that film photographs have a lot of character, but we had our wedding pictures done digitally by a photographer in north AL, and were really happy with them. I honestly couldn't tell a difference (not a photography expert or anything) between them and other people's film photographs. Plus it's neat because you can add cool effects - one of our portraits was black and white except my bouquet. And there's the all-important airbrush feature!

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Old 06-28-2006   #3 (permalink)
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Re: Digital photography

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I do agree with you that film photographs have a lot of character, but we had our wedding pictures done digitally by a photographer in north AL, and were really happy with them. I honestly couldn't tell a difference (not a photography expert or anything) between them and other people's film photographs. Plus it's neat because you can add cool effects - one of our portraits was black and white except my bouquet. And there's the all-important airbrush feature!
Digital techniques, which we use today, have opened a new field of options. I spend my day doing digital imaging in photoshop, and printing large portraits using expensive digital equipment and media. This post is all about the problem of storage of those images for longevity. Most people don't know what a large variation in longevity there is between different digital print paper, Fuji Vs. Kodak for example. And of course, the CD problem. It is the homel storage that concerns me most.

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Old 06-28-2006   #4 (permalink)
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Re: Digital photography

I can attest the cheap CD-R's don't have a very long shelf life---3 to 4 years tops. The DVD disks (brand named) seem to hold up well, though as far as archiving I couldn't tell you how well they read past 2 years. IMO, the way to go if you are archiving is having a server. You can make daily back-ups of your data, and transfer to newer servers as the old ones start to wear out.

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Old 06-28-2006   #5 (permalink)
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Re: Digital photography

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I can attest the cheap CD-R's don't have a very long shelf life---3 to 4 years tops. The DVD disks (brand named) seem to hold up well, though as far as archiving I couldn't tell you how well they read past 2 years. IMO, the way to go if you are archiving is having a server. You can make daily back-ups of your data, and transfer to newer servers as the old ones start to wear out.
Thanks Dave. Option we are looking at but still bothers me from the amateur standpoint. How archival are hard disk considered to be. I haven't gotten that far yet. Well, I guess we are saying the same thing, server - hard drive.

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Old 06-28-2006   #6 (permalink)
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Re: Digital photography

I am not trying to get everyone interested in the highly technical aspects of archival properties of photographic media, but I failed to mention that there is a company that does research and rating of these material and for those that are so inclined it is the Wilhelm Research Institute:

http://www.wilhelm-research.com/

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Old 06-28-2006   #7 (permalink)
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Re: Digital photography

A topic of interest to me. CD archival is NOT a long-term option at all. And that is what most people believe they are suppose to do. I suppose you have these options, if you don't want to take the expensive server route:

you could archive your photographs on DVDs as data disks (ISO) and take the highest precautions to keep those dry, away from heat, etc. Every two-three years, make a new copy of the DVD. This is a temporary problem I'm sure, because soon we'll probably have different storage mediums -- Flash Disks, San Disk cards are becoming very large (high-capacity) and I'd bet those are much longer lasting and dependable than any kind of optical media. They are also better because in comparison to hard disk drives, they have no moving heads to break or wear down.


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Old 06-29-2006   #8 (permalink)
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Re: Digital photography

Quote:
I can attest the cheap CD-R's don't have a very long shelf life---3 to 4 years tops. The DVD disks (brand named) seem to hold up well, though as far as archiving I couldn't tell you how well they read past 2 years. IMO, the way to go if you are archiving is having a server. You can make daily back-ups of your data, and transfer to newer servers as the old ones start to wear out.
ITA that is what I was going to say.. I save all of mine and archive them on to my computer (two actually) because as of now we don't have a server but I would like to get one especially as I move up.










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Old 06-29-2006   #9 (permalink)
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Re: Digital photography

Quote:
A topic of interest to me. CD archival is NOT a long-term option at all. And that is what most people believe they are suppose to do. I suppose you have these options, if you don't want to take the expensive server route:
you could archive your photographs on DVDs as data disks (ISO) and take the highest precautions to keep those dry, away from heat, etc. Every two-three years, make a new copy of the DVD. This is a temporary problem I'm sure, because soon we'll probably have different storage mediums -- Flash Disks, San Disk cards are becoming very large (high-capacity) and I'd bet those are much longer lasting and dependable than any kind of optical media. They are also better because in comparison to hard disk drives, they have no moving heads to break or wear down.
I am hoping high capacity cards become the answer especially for us with high volumn.

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Old 06-29-2006   #10 (