The Tea Parties #2

[saddlebum]

In another thread I stated that the stupid, hateful signs at Tea Party gatherings were an ugly drawback to the Tea Parties being accepted by most of our citizens.

Outlandish costumes, "birthers" and the racist senator from Colorado, Tom Tancredo, make the Tea Party movement seem silly and insignificant.
They will never be considered relevant to enough people to make any difference if these fringe elements continue to have a voice.

Tancredo, in this day and age, made repulsive statements about "literacy tests" and other equally vitrolic, divisive subjects.

There are Tea Party issues which I agree with but this "dis-organization" absolutely needs to distance itself from stringent, divisive people, and there are many of them.

[Kagan]

Originally Posted by saddlebum

There are Tea Party issues which I agree with but this "dis-organization" absolutely needs to distance itself from stringent, divisive people, and there are many of them.

They are looking for a "voice amplifier", but they don't believe that the major parties can or will give them a voice due to their radical stances. The major news networks (with exception of one) and major print media will continue to ignore the Tea Party movement due to the fringe elements.

Expect, however, the Tea Party movement to seek more and more publicity.

saddlebum, those Tea Party issues that you agree with can be found elsewhere...they are NOT original with the Tea Party movement.

[Kagan]

Meghan McCain, yep John's daughter, fired back at the Tea Party. She's right about young people of this generation. Negative advertising and campaigning will not work on them...regardless of which party generates it.

CNN Political Ticker: All politics, all the time Blog Archive - McCain’s daughter questions Tea Party movement - Blogs from CNN.com

[dave]

I guess Palin has her own version of the teleprompter..



My question for Palin (since she's the new queen of the tea party movement) is "If Emanuel needs to resign over the word "retarded", but it's fine for Rush to use it, would it be OK for anyone to use it while imitating Rush?"
** I don't defend anyone using the term per say--but if you're going to be outraged over someone using it, you have to be outraged over EVERYONE using it.

[Kagan]

Ron Reagan does NOT like Palin...Video - Breaking News Videos from CNN.com
And I don't like Pam because she claims that she knows President Reagan better than Ron did. What is she? A medium?

Originally Posted by dave

I guess Palin has her own version of the teleprompter..

It really doesn't look good for the Tea Party.
a) They don't provide teleprompters to their guest speakers.
b) They don't provide Tea Party stationery for guest speakers to jot notes upon.
c) They don't provide Tea Party pens for guest speakers to jot notes on their hands.

Sounds like just another political party that won't deliver.

My question for Palin (since she's the new queen of the tea party movement) is "If Emanuel needs to resign over the word "retarded", but it's fine for Rush to use it, would it be OK for anyone to use it while imitating Rush?"
** I don't defend anyone using the term per say--but if you're going to be outraged over someone using it, you have to be outraged over EVERYONE using it.

It really is a test of leadership. Who's the boss? Rush? Or Sarah? Rush has exerted more influence over the GOP since November 2008 (just over 15 months) than Sarah will if she lives to be an age twice his lifespan.

[dave]

FOXNews.com - What Do You Think Tea Party Movement Is About?
Interesting results..

If you ignore the 2 biggest talking heads of the Tea Party -- Glen Beck and Sarah Palin -- you can get a clearer sense of what this new political party is all about. Many of the points made are good ones. Most of it is common sense issues, though some of it is just plain lunacy. The protests I could take more seriously if they were doing it before Obama took office as well. I can't take the message of smaller government, fiscal responsibility seriously if it only applies to one side of the political spectrum. They are taking to the streets over "Democrats" use of tax money, yet have no problem with Senators like our own Richard Shelby basically using his power to extort ear-marks and pork funds.

Don't make Sarah Palin your hero, who was governor of the most socialist state in the union, and who's idea of "doing whats best for her state" is to quite mid term and join Fox News.

[81Tiger]

Would it be accurate to compare their cause (their real cause, not the anti-Obama movement) to Libertarianism? I'm with you, dave, in that I'm sure they could be taken more seriously if they would be shown more with issues and less with the goofball fringe.

[Kagan]

Originally Posted by dave

FOXNews.com - What Do You Think Tea Party Movement Is About?
Interesting results..

LOL I didn't vote in the poll, but I did view the results. Not exactly what you would expect from the readers of FoxNews' website.

I love the comment by the Tea Party reader who was upset because the poll was set up in such a way as to "split" the Tea Party votes. Split it in what directions? If you were a Tea Party-er and felt obliged to choose your primary reason for belonging from among those four choices, would the poll be that lopsided?

If you ignore the 2 biggest talking heads of the Tea Party -- Glen Beck and Sarah Palin -- you can get a clearer sense of what this new political party is all about.

Sadly, those two add structure to chaos.

The protests I could take more seriously if they were doing it before Obama took office as well.

I went to seminary during the Clinton years. Sadly, I well remember pastors-in-training YELLING at the TV set in the lobby everytime Clinton was on TV. The YELLS were filled with anger and hatred. So, am I surprised at statements against Obama? No. I rather expected much worse than we've seen...so far.

I can't take the message of smaller government, fiscal responsibility seriously if it only applies to one side of the political spectrum. They are taking to the streets over "Democrats" use of tax money, yet have no problem with Senators like our own Richard Shelby basically using his power to extort ear-marks and pork funds.

I haven't voted for Shelby since he switched parties right after a re-election.
Also, he FORGOT about the Black Belt after he became a U.S. Senator.

[fhtim]

I would have to say this about Palin and the notes on her hand...... I would rather listen to someone who has just a couple of notes just to keep themselves on track than to listen to someone who has to read all of their speeches in their entirity from a telepromter because they do not have a clue what to say otherwise.

Would I vote for Palin? No, but still... this is the best the White House can do? Seriously? Seriously? Gibbs is overpaid. We are wasting our taxdollars on this school-yard male cow manure? Are they that desperate for anything...anything to try to sway a vote?

If Obama is that afraid of Palin, then this country has bigger problems.

On the tea partists, if you see ads about them keep this in mind. The ads are funded by labor unions and special interest groups, with the money being funneled through numerous dummy organizations that operate out of the same office, owned by the same two people who do contract work for the Democratic Party. Do not be fooled by the names of the organizations..it is a shell game. If they have to lie to us about who they really are and who they really represent, then that is a BIG clue that they should not be trusted. Do I buy into all of the tea party stuff? Some, but there are some radical views I do not share. So you won't be seeing this old boy throwing a bag into the river. But this is America and everyone gets a voice. Even if we don't agree with it.

[saddlebum]

Actually, I have no real problem with teleprompters or notes of any sort.
Even with "cheating" I'd still stutter and stammer.

Bush must not have used teleprompters and he made "little" mistakes occasionally so his detractors said he was stupid.
BHO didn't want to chance having the same problem and I don't blame him.

The back and forth between BHO, Gibbs and Palin is really kind of humorous, and of no real significance.

These Tea Parties, and townhall meetings, are the culmination of dissatisfaction with the spending in the Bush administration and the ineptitude of both republican and democrat congressmen, as well as the BHO administration.

That said, most of the Tea Party folks are republicans, independents and fiscal conservative democrats, in that order.
That's a really large bunch of folks who will probably vote republican in the fall, mainly because BHO seems to have no intention of abandoning the issues that are undermining him.

The Tea Parties and republicans need to disengage from the fringe people, they're just wrong, ugly and obnoxious.

[Kagan]

Originally Posted by fhtim

On the tea partists, if you see ads about them keep this in mind. The ads are funded by labor unions and special interest groups, with the money being funneled through numerous dummy organizations that operate out of the same office, owned by the same two people who do contract work for the Democratic Party. Do not be fooled by the names of the organizations..it is a shell game. If they have to lie to us about who they really are and who they really represent, then that is a BIG clue that they should not be trusted.

And people say that I can dream up elaborate conspiracy theories

Do I buy into all of the tea party stuff? Some, but there are some radical views I do not share.

And there is the rub. Someone once said derogatorally of me that I have deep convictions. If an organization has a glaring deficiency, I firmly believe that the malignancy must be removed. If the "leaders" of the Tea Party don't remove it themselves, then the old HUAC needs to be revived to diminish the Tea Party as a threat to our national security from within. I'm greatly concerned about "mob justice" in American history. The Tea Party declares itself to be a leaderless group of concerned citizens. There's a problem with that throughout history. You want a revolution? So do I. However, I don't want a revolution like they had in France in the 1790s or Russia in 1917. Unfortunately, not enough Americans have read French or Russian history.

So you won't be seeing this old boy throwing a bag into the river. But this is America and everyone gets a voice. Even if we don't agree with it.

Thank you. I see that saddlebum speaks with trepidation of the Tea Party. His influence and yours can avert disaster on this board. Honestly, I have been rather uneasy about the Tea Party from the beginning although I haven't blasted it because it seemed to be growing in popularity here until saddlebum and dave began taking shots at it.

Like I said, I have a problem with a "leaderless mob" roaming the country claiming to be patriotic Americans. We have long needed a VIABLE third party in this country; however, in its present state of being, Tea Party movement is neither a political party nor a viable issue-focused organization. As long as it allows the dregs of societal thought to hitch a ride on its coattails, the Tea Party is undercutting its own goals. Revelling in leaderlessness is also deadly to its cause. Beck and Palin are not great choices either. Ron Paul would be a much more stable choice to head a movement with its more positive causes.

[fhtim]

Originally Posted by Kagan

And people say that I can dream up elaborate conspiracy theories .

Honestly, I found the information about the funding from this report from Fox
FOXNews.com - Anti-Tea Party Web Site Part of Scheme to Funnel Funds


What I find interesting and frightful in all of this mess is that the Democratic party is more interested in attcking and discrediting those in opposition, leading me to a firm belief that they are placing so much effort into this that it is clear that they have nothing else to offer. And in effect it is true. They controlled Congress for 3 years and both Congress and the White House for the last 12 months and what have they done besides run up the national debt? Spend time villianizing Rush Limbaugh and Sarah Palin and blaming the minority party.

I think there are more important things to accomplish that they clearly have been unable to get done even having the power to do so. If they had a supermajority, stopped all filabusters, and STILL couldn't get anything done, then they have no idea as to what it is they need to be doing.

I agree most of the people who attend tea parties or somewhat agree with the basic movement do fit into those catagories. But as always, it is the nuts who grab the headlines. I do hope that Washington (all political parties) does pay enough attention to realize that ,the nuts aside, America is looking for answers/solutions and that we will vote out those who can't and try to replace them with people who can. And right now, we do not like what we are seeing...

[Kagan]

Originally Posted by fhtim

What I find interesting and frightful in all of this mess is that the Democratic party is more interested in attcking and discrediting those in opposition, leading me to a firm belief that they are placing so much effort into this that it is clear that they have nothing else to offer. And in effect it is true. They controlled Congress for 3 years and both Congress and the White House for the last 12 months and what have they done besides run up the national debt? Spend time villianizing Rush Limbaugh and Sarah Palin and blaming the minority party.

You're right. It has become a vicious cycle...hasn't it? One party gets in power...without a plan...does nothing but blame the other party. Then, the other party gets in power...without a plan...does nothing but blame the first party. The sooner we as Americans quit taking sides and playing their silly game...the quicker they will learn that the jig is up.

I think there are more important things to accomplish that they clearly have been unable to get done even having the power to do so. If they had a supermajority, stopped all filabusters, and STILL couldn't get anything done, then they have no idea as to what it is they need to be doing.

Yep, this is the same reason that I became disillusioned with the GOP. For six years, they had the White House, Congress, and the Supreme Court and did nothing. Now, the DNC has White House and Congress and is doing nothing.

They enjoy the campaigning, but they don't want to do the work.
All play and no work makes Jack a worthless you know what.

I do hope that Washington (all political parties) does pay enough attention to realize that ,the nuts aside, America is looking for answers/solutions and that we will vote out those who can't and try to replace them with people who can.

Washington won't listen as long as the "nuts" are grabbing the headlines.

Massachusetts and Virginia wins were NOT GOP wins over a failed Democrat plan. They were ANTI-incumbent politician or ANTI-incumbent party elections. That surge didn't just happen. Remember Dem Lieberman lost his 2006 primary due to anti-incumbency. Palin stepped down as governor because she was a struggling incumbent. McCain is apparently in trouble due to incumbency. Arlen Specter jumped party lines because he wanted to remake himself in his trouble incumbency. Charlie Crist is in trouble in the Florida GOP primary for US Senate. The entire 2008 election from White House to the last Congressional seat wasn't about change, hope, or slick talk. It was about American people getting tired of the incumbents. Don't be surprised if some key Dems and some key GOPers fall this election year. Don't be surprised if some red states go blue, and some blue states go red.

This summer and this fall in Alabama and other states, I believe you will see a lot of anti-incumbent results as well. That will get more attention than a silly Tea Party. When we quit buying the B.S. that they generate and begin replacing them every 2, 4, or 6 years, then they will realize that they MUST represent the people.

[81Tiger]

Originally Posted by Kagan

The sooner we as Americans quit taking sides and playing their silly game, the quicker they will learn that the jig is up.

This summer and this fall in Alabama and other states, I believe you will see a lot of anti-incumbent results as well. ... When we quit buying the B.S. that they generate and begin replacing them every 2, 4, or 6 years, then they will realize that they MUST represent the people.

I have been researching "third-party" candidates with a passion for a while now, but hadn't found any that I liked. The closest was during the 2004 presidential campaign, when I found a candidate who had a lot of good common sense ideas. The kicker: his party was big on transcendental meditation, and its chairman was a yogi from — somewhere.

If anyone wants a free pass to Washington, he/she should run as an independent and lay out what he/she stands for. The parties are all about the party these days and none about the purpose. If people who feel this way don't vote in the national primaries and encourage people to run as independents, I could be a historic November.

[Kagan]

Originally Posted by 81Tiger

The kicker: his party was big on transcendental meditation, and its chairman was a yogi from — somewhere.

Isn't there always some fringe element.

If anyone wants a free pass to Washington, he/she should run as an independent and lay out what he/she stands for. The parties are all about the party these days and none about the purpose. If people who feel this way don't vote in the national primaries and encourage people to run as independents, I could be a historic November.

Wish that were possible, but financially an independent can't generate the monetary support that it would take to match the negative advertising campaign generated by GOP and Democratic candidates. An independent would be crucified in the press and the advertising. Unfortunately.